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Message Publié : 16 Août 2016, 22:27 
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Inscription : 08 Octobre 2013, 17:34
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Since we have way too much easy discard around and the "destroy-opponent-playsystyle"-playstyle grown too much and kills the fun, I came up with a conter strategie. because who can still play what he likes, without beeing disturbed by discard?

So I would suggest:

Citer :
"Safety first
uncommon
action
3-4 fights
This card cannot be discarded.
Cards the character play cannot be stopped from the opponent by discard."



Citer :
"Drink of invisibility
uncommon
drink
3-4 fights
This card cannot be discarded.
Cards that are bound onto this character cannot be discarded by the opponent."



Citer :
edit - changed too:
safety first
rare
3 turns
The opponent can not force any of your characters to throw cards into the graveyard.
When this card activates all your bounded legendaries are discarded.
As long as this card is in the game no other legendaries can be played from your characters.
Your characters cannot use any cards that use a discard-funktion as long as this card is in the game."



Citer :
Maybe this even gives stuff for a legendary like:
"They never get me!
legend, unique
action
permanent
This card cannot be discarded.
All your characters cannot lose any cards by discard.
Cards you play from now on cannot be discarded.
As long as this card is in the game no other legendaries can be played from your other characters.
Now we can fight without any disturbance.


Citer :
edit changed too:
They never get me!
legend, unique
action
2-3 fights
Choose a character to this card on him.
When the card is bound it will activate it's effects.
The opponent can not force any of your characters to throw cards into the graveyard.
Your characters cannot use any cards that use a discard-funktion.
When this card activates all bounded legendaries from all your characters are moved out of the game.
As long as this card is in the game no other legendaries can be played from your characters.
When this card is discarded it moves out of the game.
Now we can fight without any disturbance.


Explanation:
Why I forbid to play it with other legends is easy, since a combination with or would be imba and could not be stopped anymore.

If we would allow to play other legendaries, this card must have aduration (3 fights) and has to remove itself from the game, to avoid imba and unstoppable combinations.

Another Idea was to make discard impossible for bouth players through this legendary.


Citer :
At last a character for everyone:
level 3
"Quick-change artist Mirror
legend
2
5/8
3
15
Gets the guilds, classes, races of your other chars.
The cards bound on this character cannot be removed from the opponent.
Cards this character plays cannot be stopped by discard from the opponent.
This character is unable to play any legendaries.
Every even turn the character adds the caste of your other chars.


Explanation:
The character has to fit in every deck, to make it fair. Just using this on one or only a few guilds would be unfair. (Althogh I would also like him as zil-only char, hehe.) But so he gives every player the chance to a game without strategy-destroy or at least less of it. But a character that also gains the stats from other chars would be too strong, so this one has fixed stats. I forbid to play legends to avoid, that he gets too OP during the game.

I dont give the caste permanent, because even some eventchars do not get everything from other chars. To copy really everything from the own chars (guilds, races, classes, castes, stats) would make him the best "copy-char" the game has yet seen.

Another idea could be to make him marauder, warrior, mage to make him possible for most decks. But he still has to copy the guilds and races, and maybe the caste.

And this char would really be worth his legend-rarity. =)

_________________
/\_/\
>^,^<
-/ \
(__)__,
Al hail and glory to the Zil, the living Shadow and the Circus!

PS.: Right now I'm only on for calendar. Not playing activ.
We lost the balance too bad since the damned sacred cards.


Dernière édition par Cat_Wachter le 26 Septembre 2016, 21:24, édité 2 fois.

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Message Publié : 16 Août 2016, 23:04 
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Cat_Wachter a écrit :
Since we have way too much easy discard around and the "destroy-opponent-playsystyle"-playstyle grown too much and kills the fun, I came up with a conter strategie. because who can still play what he likes, without beeing disturbed by discard?

So I would suggest:

Citer :
"Safety first
uncommon
action
3-4 fights
This card cannot be discarded.
Cards the character play cannot be stopped from the opponent by discard."



Citer :
"Drink of invisibility
uncommon
drink
3-4 fights
This card cannot be discarded.
Cards that are bound onto this character cannot be discarded by the opponent."



Citer :
Maybe this even gives stuff for a legendary like:
"They never get me!
legend, unique
action
permanent
This card cannot be discarded.
All your characters cannot lose any cards by discard.
Cards you play from now on cannot be discarded.
As long as this card is in the game no other legendaries can be played from your other characters.
Now we can fight without any disturbance.


Explanation:
Why I forbid to play it with other legends is easy, since a combination with or would be imba and could not be stopped anymore.

If we would allow to play other legendaries, this card must have aduration (3 fights) and has to remove itself from the game, to avoid imba and unstoppable combinations.

Another Idea was to make discard impossible for bouth players through this legendary.


Citer :
At last a character for everyone:
level 3
"Quick-change artist Mirror
legend
2
5/8
3
15
Gets the guilds, classes, races of your other chars.
The cards bound on this character cannot be removed from the opponent.
Cards this character plays cannot be stopped by discard from the opponent.
This character is unable to play any legendaries.
Every even turn the character adds the caste of your other chars.


Explanation:
The character has to fit in every deck, to make it fair. Just using this on one or only a few guilds would be unfair. (Althogh I would also like him as zil-only char, hehe.) But so he gives every player the chance to a game without strategy-destroy or at least less of it. But a character that also gains the stats from other chars would be too strong, so this one has fixed stats. I forbid to play legends to avoid, that he gets too OP during the game.

I dont give the caste permanent, because even some eventchars do not get everything from other chars. To copy really everything from the own chars (guilds, races, classes, castes, stats) would make him the best "copy-char" the game has yet seen.

Another idea could be to make him marauder, warrior, mage to make him possible for most decks. But he still has to copy the guilds and races, and maybe the caste.

And this char would really be worth his legend-rarity. =)


cat, you do know, that those cards are pretty damn broken and would the moment they hit the game enable chaos for casual and competitive play. even your non-legendaries have legendary effects that a game breaking. I am very sorry if I sound rude, but I would quit a game that does not allow me to get rid of the threats my opponents put on the table. I must sound like a broken record but why, do people think of counter mechanics as fun ruining nonsense? I really do not understand?
And by destroying control or attrition decks, like your cards try to do, it just creates a worse game.

And just as side not, I said try to do so, but fail badly. Picture for a second, what such cards would do I a deck that exploits the fact that cards that would normally discard them self. And no legendaries as a solution? Well it is not like we have a crap ton of cards that would be OP with such effects...

I really am sorry, if sounded like a doushbag, but those kind of cards are bad for the game at it is now.

_________________
Looking for a new Pauper Eredan (Copper/Copper&Silver) and/or Titan deck (50 cards singleton) playgroup! If you are interested just PM me. ^^

Suche nach einer neuen Pauper Eredan (Kupfer/Kupfer&Silber) und/oder Titan deck (50 Karten je eine Kopie) Spielgruppe! Wer Interesse hat, schreibt mir einfach eine PM. ^^


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Message Publié : 17 Août 2016, 00:22 
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i also thought alot about this problem with discards these days and even though i agree that the ideas of cat are really too heavy on gameplay i still feel that something ought to be done about the "new" discard style which relies on putting enemy cards into the own graveyard...

currently there are 2 forms of discards...

original - just drop all you hand
new style - steal each and every card from enemy graveyard

as original style could be harmed by "a new start" and other recycle cards and thus is somehow forced to randomly toss in an anathem the new style wont be affected by recycle at all... in fact there is no way to get your own cards back from the enemy

thus i suggest this card to solve this problem and offer a new playstyle...

whats mine, is yours...
action
no guild

effect: you and your enemy exchange all cards in your graveyards


so what i think this card will do... it will give a player a chance to start recylcling again... as this card will be played in mid to end of match i think the priests by then will still be quiet well equipped or overly strong thus not heavly handicapped...

i also think this card could make an awesome effect against decks that rely on their own graveyard such as some fire mages or undeads or some such...

you surely can see that this card would carry lots of risks as well thus i think its not too broken... so what do you think?


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Message Publié : 17 Août 2016, 01:35 
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@ Calandra:
There is a 3. discard playstyle:
"I steal all your bound items and all the cards you are just playing"
I call it equip-discard and play-discard and this is the really desastrios discard strategy I want to conter, because throwing hand cards is one thing, but losing all stuff I built up and lose the stuff I just wanted to play is game destroying and fun destroying.

Your card idea is a good conter vs the new Zil discard priests ... but it would not help vs zombies that empty your graveyard into the void.
And it would not affect the 3. discard playstyle, that I personally think is the most annoying, since you could stop to play cards anyway and fight naked instead.
(in the good old days it was only but now we have ).

In some cases this discard is so mean it really would do no difference, if I stop playing cards and fight naked. When I think about my Zil dagger, that only equip less cards. That is totally equip-discarded very fast and then makes 0 dmg.
Even my pack only lost vs the immortals only because their equip-discard and play-discard for example + was faster than I was playing the cards and he recycled this cards so often, I saw naptys 4 times and heimvorteil 6 times during that game. So I could not build up anything, while they were growing with and saved by . I did not lose vs their heal, I lost vs their equip-discard and they play-disturb-discard.

And this is why I think we need a sort of but vs discard.

@ Griefstone
Maybe 3 fights may a bit long (So they are at what I personally think is much worse, when we have 2 or 3 astronomie active at the same time.) ... but I cannot play any deck normal, since I always get my permanents or just played cards discarded. (If your read what I wrote Calandra then you understand, what I mean.)

If discard happens once or 2 times in a game, okay ... but some decks (like immortals) use discard nearly every turn. No possibility to build up anything with my dagger or my pack and just being a weak prey as if I would play no cards, because the opponent has cards that buff themself and destroy my strategie at the same time. or with immortals who use the direct dmg to heal themself or most prominent example .

We have so many card that buff and discard at the same time and often enough one of it's effect was strong enough. (At least, we have some guilds, that have those discard-buff cards and some guilds, that only have painful discard. I do not know any discard-card for zil warrior with the same strength, than and even is limited, since I only can throw Items and I can play them only in very few situations.)

Originally discard was only hand throwing (like Calandra mentioned) and was need to done fast before the chars die (Zil discard of old times). And all other discard always had also a painful effect to the user himself , or was very limited . But Now we got so many easy discard, that even buffs the owner, that it is no fun to play vs those cards.

And you tell me it was brocken to stop those game-destroy cards?
Maybe that could even be a new game style. ;)

We have cards that heal - and those that stop healing
We have spells - and we have cards that make immun vs spells and magic dmg
We have spirit, def, atk - but it can be reduced
We have discard - so a totally logic conter was to stop discard for a time of the game.

Why you think discard not brocken, but stoping discard is? oO

You tell me:
I destroy your game-strategy is fair.
I destroy your game-destroy-strategy is unfair.
...
Really? But I cannot understand the difference. If the second one is unfair, then the first one is unfair too. When you can interrupt my gameplay, I should be able to interrupt your interrupting. The more I think about it, the more I think it is really necessary to bring in this strategy somehow.

Even for the paper-stone-scissior-effect this playpossibility should be added to the game.

And to avoid missunderstandings:
The discard-stop is only ment on opponents discard!
If I wear a card that has limited turns or fights, those will disaepper normally. (If those would all be permanent I would agree those were broken, but those have to discard themselfs as normal.)
And in one point you are right, I forgot what happens if a legend is already played and saved by chaining one of these cards. So the cards need even greater restrictions to avoid a combination with legendaries.

So how about better versions of those cards:

Citer :
"Safety first
rare
action
2-3 fights
This card cannot be discarded.
Cards the character play cannot be stopped from the opponent by discard.
When this card activates all your bounded legendaries discarded.
As long as this card is in the game no other legendaries can be played from your other characters.
chain"


Citer :
"Drink of invisibility
rare
drink
2-3 fights
This card cannot be discarded.
Cards that are bound onto this character cannot be discarded by the opponent.
When this card activates all your bounded legendaries discarded.
As long as this card is in the game no other legendaries can be played from your other characters.
chain"


Citer :
"They never get me!
legend, unique
action
3-4 fights
This card cannot be discarded.
All your characters cannot lose any cards by discard.
Cards you play from now on cannot be discarded.
Your characters cannot use any cards that use a discard-funktion.
When this card activates all your bounded legendaries from all your characters are discarded.
As long as this card is in the game no other legendaries can be played from your characters.
When this card is discarded it moves out of the game.
chain
Now we can fight without any disturbance.


With this limitations for yourself, too, you had to think hard before using these cards. They are tactical cards you cannot use brain afk. I would really think, if I would play those now, since they does not keep me save very long and 2 of them only protect one character and this is why I added cain to the cards.

By the way (3 fights) or + (5 turns) have the same or even higher duration and are much worse cards, than this discard-stop-cards that still allow the opponent to do hand-discard on me and play normal buff cards. So my opponent can play normally with me, even if he has a Zil or abara discarder deck that wants me to go card dead.

A card like would still have it's effects except the discard part. These cards are just like or a for discard.

_________________
/\_/\
>^,^<
-/ \
(__)__,
Al hail and glory to the Zil, the living Shadow and the Circus!

PS.: Right now I'm only on for calendar. Not playing activ.
We lost the balance too bad since the damned sacred cards.


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Message Publié : 17 Août 2016, 12:34 
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Disclaimer: I am a little bit short on time, so I will add more to this post later on. And I want to apologies if I offend anyone with my objective and subjective comments or thoughts on certain aspect of this Topic. Reader discretion is advised.

Citer :
Safety first

action

This card cannot be discarded.
//This type of mechanic is actually really good and would make a lot of sense in hyper aggressive decktypes, which are found in Zil or Nehant//
Cards the character play cannot be stopped from the opponent by discard.
//As support mechanic, okay. Set up your next fight with this character too be able make difference. OR use it as a cheap gateway, to play a 6 chain combo that cannot be interrupted by your opponent. And if you played Craftsmen, you know, that legendaries are not needed for such shenanigans.//
When this card activates all your bounded legendaries discarded.
//Well, that is a little specific. And sound more like a excuse to play such a card. It is not bad, but just weird.//
As long as this card is in the game no other legendaries can be played from your other characters.
//Well it is debatable if this would be considered balanced, even considering the fact only your other characters lose the ability to use LGs (legendaries). And just like the above part a little weird, but not bad.//
chain
//SHIT!... I don't mean your card, but the fact that I read chain here, makes me feel uncomfortable. Chain is so powerful in Eredan, that slapping it on almost all card ideas, can be considered gimmicky and thoughtless, rather than objective. But that is just "Chain". Looking at your wording you could play a LG after this card. As well as setting yourself up for a game ending turn.//
rare
//LG//
2-3 fights
//3 Turns or 2 Fights. Everything else could be considered broken.//


Sooo... first one done. (rest following)

Citer :
currently there are 2 forms of discards...

original - just drop all you hand
new style - steal each and every card from enemy graveyard


Because of that I will refer to the discard Cat speaks to as "disruption".

Citer :
whats mine, is yours...
action
no guild

effect: you and your enemy exchange all cards in your graveyards
//Well... I really like this card. (explanation following)//


@Cat_Watcher:

First of all I think we can agree to disagree.

Citer :
Maybe 3 fights may a bit long

OH HELL YES!

Citer :
but I cannot play any deck normal, since I always get my permanents or just played cards <disrupted>.

I see where you are coming from and agree with the this argument, 'cause of one reason...
Citer :
<...> Now we got so many easy <disruption>, that even buffs the owner, that it is no fun//sorry, but fun is debatable// to play vs those cards.

I am a strong supporter of counterbalance mechanics in games, for they serve a meaningful purpose in fast metas and against cheap combo builds.
And if handled correctly, can help to develop a healthy gameexperience for all parties.

And that is were the problem begins. Feerik do not handle their cardgame's mechanics well. This problem will get worse, the more they follow their current course of "semi-incestuous card-recycling". Tbh, even the GLs cannot make years of little designmistakes and inconsistencies right.

(at this point I only have 30-40 min left. so, I will focus on some other parts on your comment.)

Citer :
Why <do> you think <disruption is> not brocken, but <disabling disruption> is? oO

You tell me:
I destroy your game-strategy is fair.
I destroy your game-destroy-strategy is unfair.


Disruption is a two-way-functional gamemechanic that is able to work against itself, provided that the player is able to work with the tools given to him. But, in a heterogeneous game, this is only possible if the tools are given to him in the in the first place and in a partially equal manner.

Eredan is such a heterogeneous game, but lacks the diverse disruption for the different playstyles. Not that it would be good to have hyper aggressive decks that can easily disrupt any card that comes their way, but I think you catch my drift.

And claiming it would destroy a game, sounds more like personal grudge and not like a objective viewpoint.
I strongly recommend you try other cardgames (that are not HS or TES:L) or look into strategic and/or social tabletop games.

UNFAIR?!...well...
As I said it works against itself. Also the introduction of non-disruptive objects is also an alternative. But creating a non-disruptive bubble mechanic, with a long duration in that it cannot be interacted with, is wrong and lacks foresight.
For it creates a possibility of having non-disruptive disruption.

(countering counters with counters is functional and good. But giving counters the ability of not getting countered, while doing their job really good, is really bad.)

And arguing that, then all players could use such cards and therefor nullifying the existence of counterbalance mechanics, is naiv and would create a game, in which the fastest deck wins. Even more then now.

Citer :
We have <disruption> - so a totally logic <counter> was to stop <disruption> for a time of the game.

In some game yes, in others no. And disruption disrupts disruption. (a lot of bloody disruption) (@.@; )!?

_________________
Looking for a new Pauper Eredan (Copper/Copper&Silver) and/or Titan deck (50 cards singleton) playgroup! If you are interested just PM me. ^^

Suche nach einer neuen Pauper Eredan (Kupfer/Kupfer&Silber) und/oder Titan deck (50 Karten je eine Kopie) Spielgruppe! Wer Interesse hat, schreibt mir einfach eine PM. ^^


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Message Publié : 18 Août 2016, 15:18 
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At first, I think it is okay disrupt 1 or 2 times in a game ... but to disrupt and steal bounded cards every turn, and steal 1, 2 or even 3 cards per turn ... that really destroys fun. And this is, why I had the idea to conter discrupt.

We have too much too easy discrupt or card steal, that also buffs the owner (but only for some guilds) ... so this is unfair.

Back to my idea:
Citer :
safety first
rare
3 turns
The opponent can not force any of your characters to throw cards into the graveyard.
When this card activates all your bounded legendaries are discarded.
As long as this card is in the game no other legendaries can be played from your characters.
Your characters cannot use any cards that use a discard-funktion as long as this card is in the game."


3 turns or 2 fights are too less duration, if it only protects 1 character. So if the duration is dropped further, it has to protect all charcters.

I did not use chain thoughtles. In the first version it had no chain, because it is powerful. But since the duration was reduced, I added chain, because a card that protects disrupt for only 2 fights could end up nearly worthless. (Even more if it only has 3 turns and so maybe discarded itself before a second use.)

With the legendary-limitation I made a mistake. I want to avoid, that legendaries can be combined with this card. This is why it discards all bounded legendaries and dont allow the chars (and I ment all the chars, even if I wrote it wrong on the card)
to play any legendary.

I now am thinking if I would add on the legendary version "choose a character to bind on him" since then there even was the possibility to use it on opponent chars and force the opponent to put all actual legends into the graveyard and bouth players to play no legendaries or disrupt or steal (which forces bouth players to the original playstyle of their decks and to a more fair game, if I know, that he uses many legends in his deck.)

Citer :
"They never get me!
legend, unique
action
2-3 fights
Choose a character to this card on him.
When the card is bound it will activate it's effects.
The opponent can not force any of your characters to throw cards into the graveyard.
Your characters cannot use any cards that use a discard-funktion.
When this card activates all bounded legendaries from all your characters are moved out of the game.
As long as this card is in the game no other legendaries can be played from your characters.
When this card is discarded it moves out of the game.
Now we can fight without any disturbance.


This looks like a really powerful legendary but not as bad, as tornado or last barrier, since it stops from playing legends or disrupt or stealing by yourself. Also now this card can be stopped, if it is dirupted before it activates (what should be easy nowadys, if you know when this card would be played).

After it activated it protects itself. xD

I would love to play these cards vs immortals (hehe and vs elfinnes) and it also is a great conter vs or (oh, I forgot, the last one was banned in Amnezy since it was felt as too strong *cough* even though it is weaker than or )

_________________
/\_/\
>^,^<
-/ \
(__)__,
Al hail and glory to the Zil, the living Shadow and the Circus!

PS.: Right now I'm only on for calendar. Not playing activ.
We lost the balance too bad since the damned sacred cards.


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Message Publié : 20 Août 2016, 01:56 
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wow so much text... cat could you please explain the decktype you would see as the 3rd discard type? i think you are mixing discard with counter here... but maybe i didnt quite get you

and yes my card idea would counter undead since it empties "their" graveyard... if you dont play exactly undeads yourself you would exchange a graveyard full of necrosises against something they cant recycle


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Message Publié : 20 Août 2016, 09:12 
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Got some time:

Citer :
whats mine, is yours...
action
no guild

effect: you and your enemy exchange all cards in your graveyards
//Well... I really like this card. (explanation following)//


I really, really like this card.
It deals with Necro, P-Golem, RL-Priests, Abara Discard, Lvl-Up... and a whole lot of different decks that love to recycle their cards or rely heavily on the discardpile.

And it opens up design space.

Yes, it has its risks and could screw you over if misplayed, but that would be mostly in cases of a bad match up or in a deck not suited for such a card.

Back to design space.

"What's mine is yours...", has the potential to create a a more functional old-school Zil priest deck, that counted your cards under your opponents control. And even laying a foundation for revers discardpile stacking strategies, that allow you to play cards from your opponents pile.
All in all, its a very nice niche card, that would be awesome, if we would have a sideboard option in the game. ^^

_________________
Looking for a new Pauper Eredan (Copper/Copper&Silver) and/or Titan deck (50 cards singleton) playgroup! If you are interested just PM me. ^^

Suche nach einer neuen Pauper Eredan (Kupfer/Kupfer&Silber) und/oder Titan deck (50 Karten je eine Kopie) Spielgruppe! Wer Interesse hat, schreibt mir einfach eine PM. ^^


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Message Publié : 21 Août 2016, 12:24 
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Cat, please do not be offended... I really mean it.


Citer :
At first, I think it is okay disrupt 1 or 2 times in a game //Ehm... this would be impossible considering some decks rely on disruption//... but to disrupt and steal bounded cards every turn, and steal 1, 2 or even 3 cards per turn
//That depends mostly on the match up//...
that really destroys fun //And I think allowing certain decks to annihilate your entire team with cheap card interactions, not disabling the use of event characters during tournaments, the lack of a sideboard, the constant upgrade to older cards during updates instead of downgrading a whole bunch of stuff in the game, the lack of an intelligent matchmaking system, the implementation of loads, how boosters are handled, the current cx inflation, the high bar of entry, the lack of clarification/communication with feerik, the weekly updates... I could keep on going... I personally think those are some of the problems that really ruin the fun for me and other players, with similar mind set, and not if i am able to play a not optimized deck in a bad match up....
But fun is subjective.//
. And this is, why I had the idea to conter discrupt.

We have too much too easy discrupt or card steal, that also buffs the owner (but only for some guilds) ... so this is unfair.
//Yes, that is true, but that means nerfing such cards would be healthier for the game instead of finding an answer of similar or higher power level. In addition to that, not all guilds can or should have access to some types of card mechanics. And if they do, should have their own unique twist to them. But currently Feerik seems to focus more on powering cards up instead of down and therefor limiting themselves.//


Back to my idea:

Citer :
safety first
rare
3 turns
The opponent can not force any of your characters to throw cards into the graveyard.

//what could go wrong?
, , , , , , , , , , , , , , etc.//


When this card activates all your bounded legendaries are discarded.
//...okay?//
As long as this card is in the game no other legendaries can be played from your characters.
//...okaaay?//
Your characters cannot use any cards that use a discard-funktion as long as this card is in the game."
//...okaa......wait what?! So, you cannot interact with your opponent? neither through hand discard or by nullifying plays he/she is making... And you cannot get rid of cards in play?//

//this is a bad card. the first part could get out of hand, but gets easily overshadowed by the last part. All you are doing that turn is playing Trump aka building a wall...that can be countered and puts you a turn behind//

3 turns or 2 fights are too less duration, if it only protects 1 character. So if the duration is dropped further, it has to protect all charcters.
//Well, depends on the deck. The cards I mentioned, are examples I only spend 5 minutes looking for. And those are only the tip of the iceberg. There are even interactions out there, that we would not even find in 5 days of theorizing and research. Still, 3 turns of basically saying "FU!" is pretty OP, even on bad card.//

I did not use chain thoughtles. //I am sorry.// In the first version it had no chain, because it is powerful. But since the duration was reduced, I added chain, because a card that protects disrupt for only 2 fights could end up nearly worthless. (Even more if it only has 3 turns and so maybe discarded itself before a second use.)

With the legendary-limitation I made a mistake. I want to avoid, that legendaries can be combined with this card. This is why it discards all bounded legendaries and dont allow the chars (and I ment all the chars, even if I wrote it wrong on the card)
to play any legendary.
//Okay//

<...>


Citer :
"They never get me!
legend, unique
action
2-3 fights
//...//
Choose a character to this card on him.
//You can choose your opponent? If yes, how does the card function?//
When the card is bound it will activate it's effects.
//Good//
The opponent can not force any of your characters to throw cards into the graveyard.
//This could be a wording problem. Because of the inconsistency of the word "discard" on other cards.//
Your characters cannot use any cards that use a discard-funktion.
//Same issue.//
When this card activates all bounded legendaries from all your characters are moved out of the game.
//...okay...//
As long as this card is in the game no other legendaries can be played from your characters.
//Okay...Sounds reasonable. Same goes for the first card.//
When this card is discarded it moves out of the game.
//Okay//
Now we can fight without any disturbance.




This looks like a really powerful legendary but not as bad, as tornado or last barrier, since it stops from playing legends or disrupt or stealing by yourself. Also now this card can be stopped, if it is dirupted before it activates (what should be easy nowadys, if you know when this card would be played).

After it activated it protects itself. xD

I would love to play these cards vs immortals (hehe and vs elfinnes) //A personal vendetta?// and it also is a great conter vs geheimnis des raben or der gott des bösen (oh, I forgot, the last one was banned in Amnezy since it was felt as too strong *cough* even though it is weaker than der richtige augenblick or last barrier)//debatable//



------
Citer :
I now am thinking if I would add on the legendary version "choose a character to bind on him" since then there even was the possibility to use it on opponent chars and force the opponent to put all actual legends into the graveyard and bouth players to play no legendaries or disrupt or steal (which forces bouth players to the original playstyle of their decks and to a more fair game, if I know, that he uses many legends in his deck.)

Sorry, skipped that part.

Now my honest and totally biased opinion on that quote:

This statement basically implies, that people playing any kind of control deck, do not have or use an original/real playstyle.

Handlock - not the original style
Halo - not the original style
Zil-Priest - not the original style
Elfine - not the original style
Immortal Mill - not the original style
Shoulong Control - not the original style
Zil Discard - not the original style
Abara Discard - not the original style
And the rest I am to lazy to even mention at this point - not the original style

I really do not hope this was the message you tried to deliver. Or was it?

Back to the great equalizer that is "They never get me!".
Forcing both players to rely on non-LGs is really hilarious and would make certain games more interesting. (well, there still is to break such a card)
Making it impossible to get rid of other players threats... it depends on the match up and there for is up to the players skilllevel to make such a thing work.
And it screws over any type of disruption ones it hits the table. Calling that fair is an overstatement, but...yeah, fine.
In my opinion there could be other ways to deal with disruption, but that's just me.

Looks far better then the first and second iteration. Even if they are a little weirdly worded here and there. ^^

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Suche nach einer neuen Pauper Eredan (Kupfer/Kupfer&Silber) und/oder Titan deck (50 Karten je eine Kopie) Spielgruppe! Wer Interesse hat, schreibt mir einfach eine PM. ^^


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Message Publié : 23 Août 2016, 23:33 
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Calandra a écrit :
wow so much text... cat could you please explain the decktype you would see as the 3rd discard type? i think you are mixing discard with counter here... but maybe i didnt quite get you

and yes my card idea would counter undead since it empties "their" graveyard... if you dont play exactly undeads yourself you would exchange a graveyard full of necrosises against something they cant recycle


There is a 3. discard playstyle:
"I steal all your bound items and all the cards you are just playing"
I call it equip-discard and play-discard and this is the really desastrios discard strategy I want to conter, because throwing hand cards is one thing, but losing all stuff I built up and lose the stuff I just wanted to play is game destroying and fun destroying.

This is what GriefStome called desruption. ;)

@ GriefStone
I think we could come nearer together but I did not think of something important:
How would you design such a card as "They never get me".
I really would love to see your version of the card, to see how you fokus on it and what limitations are important for you. =)

My goal was:
- disable disrupt-funktions for bouth player
- If played on an own char disable the own legend cards.
- If played on an opponent char then disable opponents legends (hm, maybe then there is a weaknis in my concept ... so I had to disable legends for bouth players? Or always for the original owner of the card?).

However, it would be nice to read your version of the card. =)

PS.: Vs immortals it truly is a personal vendetta xD for their every-turn-one-or-two-disrupt. =( As I told one or two times in a games is okay, but 10 times during a 8 turn game (or 18 times during an 12 turn game) is too hard, I think. Immortals are strong enough even without their disrupt.

_________________
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>^,^<
-/ \
(__)__,
Al hail and glory to the Zil, the living Shadow and the Circus!

PS.: Right now I'm only on for calendar. Not playing activ.
We lost the balance too bad since the damned sacred cards.


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